• Skip to primary navigation
  • Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar

Charles Eisenstein

  • About
  • Essays
  • Videos
  • Podcasts
    • Charles Eisenstein Random
    • New and Ancient Story Podcast
  • Courses
    • Climate — Inside and Out
    • Conversations with Orland Bishop, Course One
    • Conversations with Orland Bishop, Course Two
    • Conversations with Orland Bishop, Course Three
    • Dietary Transformation from the Inside Out
    • Living in the Gift
    • Masculinity: A New Story
    • Metaphysics & Mystery
    • Space Between Stories
    • Unlearning: For Change Agents
  • Books
    • The Coronation
    • Climate — A New Story
    • The More Beautiful World Our Hearts Know Is Possible
    • The Ascent of Humanity
    • Sacred Economics
    • The Yoga of Eating
  • Events
  • Donate

Employment in Gift Culture

October 28, 2014 by Charles Eisenstein 20 Comments

October 2014


 

I’m never quite sure how to introduce Marie Goodwin. Sometimes it is “my way over-qualified assistant.” Sometimes it is as my support person or my colleague. Sometimes she introduces herself with “I work for Charles.” But the one we like best is “Chief plate spinner and external hard drive.” I also like “support person” though, because she is such a tremendous support not only with the logistics of my work, but also as an intellectual resource and a source of wise advice.But let’s cut to the chase. I write and speak a lot about gift culture, new economy, and how the defining narratives of our culture shape our relationships with each other. I write about it, but how do I apply these ideas in practice? Some questions might come to mind when you hear that Marie works for me. Some people think she works for free, and wonder whether I am using lofty notions of gift to justify what is really an exploitative economic relationship. Others might suspect that, when push comes to shove, I hire an employee just like everyone else, exploiting the surplus value of her labor, willfully oblivious to the attendant power dynamics of employment.

With Marie’s agreement I would therefore like to describe how the money works in our relationship and how that came about, in hopes of illuminating one way to bring gift principles into the realm of work.

It all started three years ago when Sacred Economics was coming out. A prominent individual urged me to hire a publicist and recommended his own publicist to me as “the best in the business, someone with the perfect connections, experience, and intellect to get your work.” So I called her up and interviewed her and she did seem highly competent. Then I asked her, “If money were not an issue at all, if, say, you were independently wealthy and did this work for free, would you still want to take me on as a client?” She replied, “Honestly, no. From what I’ve read I think you do great work and I’m happy to represent you, but fundamentally I’ll be working for you – and I’ll do a great job – because you are paying me.”

I told her no thank you. I realized that I want someone to recommend my work only if they want to for real, and not because I’m paying them to. Otherwise, any promotion or publicity would be tainted with a kind of inauthenticity. And we are sick of the lies, the PR, the sales pitch. So I decided that I would only hire someone if they weren’t doing it for the money.

Shortly thereafter, Marie came along. When we discussed the idea of her working with me, she insisted on working in the gift. At first, she was part of a small group of volunteers to help me deal with email and logistics. It soon became apparent that these tasks were interrelated and mostly needed to be done by one person. Over the course of a month or two she took on more and more of this work, and in gratitude I said, “Let me give you some money.”

She said, “You really don’t need to, I’m not doing this for money, I just believe in your work and want to help you.”

I said, “But I want to.” And every month since, I have wanted to, always in a spirit of gratitude.

Often it seems to me that I am paying her too little, and to her that I am paying her too much. Of course these terms only make sense in reference to the mainstream economy, in which, both of us know, she could make a lot more money given her intellect and qualifications. As could I. But both of us have chosen a different path. Her work for me fits in not only with her values, but with her life as a homeschooling mom, Transition Town activist, time bank founder and facilitator, and running a small herbal CSA.

I offer this as one of many possible models for bringing the spirit of the gift into the world of money. Its success so far is built on mutual trust and our common commitment to a purpose that is sacred to both of us. I’m not sure how well it would translate to other kinds of work relationships that don’t have these qualities. Nonetheless, I think this kind of arrangement may become widespread as more and more people take up work that feels sacred to them. When we depend on each other to further that work, we naturally desire to take care of each other, our comrades.



Previous: Localization Beyond Economics
Next: The Waters of Heterodoxy

Filed Under: Money, Gift, & Economics, Short Reflection Tagged With: gift, gift economy, Short Reflection

Reader Interactions

Comments

  1. Adrian Hoppel says

    October 28, 2014 at 3:23 am

    Thanks for sharing this, Charles! Successful examples of working in the gift are much needed, and Marie is a wonderful human. Very glad you two found each other.

    Reply
  2. Barry mcevoy says

    October 28, 2014 at 3:35 am

    Thanks Marie and Charles for sharing details of your working relationship, it is I believe a profound example of the shift in human interaction to achieve our now Sacred goals of a better world.
    I am an economist in the public sector in n Ireland and I see how so much community work is stalled by money issues its the great obstacle. ..I am mindful of the opening to Sacred economics which I have read. .. To doing what motivates people in a community spirit.
    Marie give me some advice on time banking which I greatly appreciated and sincerely hope to return to in my public sector job. I am also looking for ways to live in the gift and intend to start volunteering in near future with a view to moving career!
    Namaste my brother and sister continued successful wishes in your vital work,

    Reply
  3. Luis Amaral says

    October 28, 2014 at 3:51 am

    Thanks Charles (and Marie) 🙂
    100% with you both. Good practices rule!
    You are role modeling and leading by example.
    – I’m pretty much tired of preachers that do not practice their speech.

    Reply
  4. Caleb Williams says

    October 28, 2014 at 4:09 am

    The Camphill Movement is an international movement with over 100 places that include people with developmental disabilities in family units run by volunteers who do not take a salary, but “share life” with the handicapped people. Because the co-workers share their roof, their heat, their light, and their food with the people for whom they care, it is not possible to effectively separate the costs of “care” from the costs of “Living.” These communities are based on Rudolf Steiner’s Fundamental Social Law: “The more an individual works for the benefit of society or the needs of others, and the more society ensures that each worker is supported sufficiently to lead a dignified existence, the greater the well-being and prosperity of society will be.”
    Here is a really good article on the subject:
    http://thecenterforsocialresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/fundamentalsociallaw.pdf#page=1&zoom=auto,-109,798
    Best wishes to all!

    Reply
    • Jim Wurster says

      October 28, 2014 at 6:35 am

      I recently visited Camphill Soltane. We love the idea of the family units as a place where our daughter could live. My wife and I are looking at this model as a place for our daughter. If only we had known about this 5 years ago when she was 21.
      Great example. Thanks for sharing Charles and Marie.

      Reply
  5. Carol says

    October 28, 2014 at 6:21 am

    Really glad to read the process. Thank you for posting, and
    great to see a pix

    Reply
  6. Tim Graham says

    October 28, 2014 at 9:57 am

    Charles how do you deal with the “surrounding system” which would view this as employment. Example; tax, insurance and other legalities?

    Reply
    • Marie Goodwin says

      October 28, 2014 at 1:25 pm

      Hey Tim,
      We both report this on our taxes. I pay for my own health insurance.

      Reply
      • Sharon Blick says

        October 28, 2014 at 5:19 pm

        But what about all the other employment laws: minimum wage, workers comp, payroll taxes?

        Reply
      • Marie says

        October 29, 2014 at 2:40 am

        Sharon & Tim, I am an independent contractor. I actually have other clients too and work in the same fashion with them, although the vast majority of my time (and my head-space) is Charles’ work.

        Reply
  7. Marie says

    October 29, 2014 at 2:44 am

    “Clients” is an exaggeration — really it is “client” (one. Singular. And truly the work I do for him is loosely considered “work” in my book), the author Ben Hewitt, who also is deeply aligned with my values. I also consider his work sacred, and Ben & Charles know each other.

    Reply
  8. Joseph Dartez says

    October 29, 2014 at 2:08 pm

    One of the issues that comes up with the gift economy is how to interact with people who do not necessarily adopt the model or who would not adopt it unless you were the one to enforce it.
    People who work with clients on a gift-type basis, like consultants, have people come to them who either aren’t familiar with a gift economy or aren’t disciplined enough to stick to it. In these kinds of circumstances, gifters are commonly stripped of their energy because they did not receive enough in return. While we could get into the psychology of martyrdom here, we cannot deny that the Universe punishes unequal exchange.
    This problem can be handled, though, if we take a different perspective. When you pay for something, you tend to appreciate it more–like buying a CD versus downloading music on the internet. Investment commits you to whatever you are investing in, so your stake in it enforces upon you the discipline to appreciate the service. Thus, in the case of a consultant, some kind of payment agreement is actually a service to the consultee, because the consultee is more likely to take the consultant seriously thereby.
    It is best to judge on a case-by-case basis, but the underlying point is I’m trying to make is that sometimes requiring payment for a service is itself a gift, like climbing up a mountain before meditating.

    Reply
  9. jon hanzen says

    October 30, 2014 at 1:55 am

    This premise that Charles is working with can also be understood as ‘Stewardship’. And there is a fantastic book entitled ‘Stewardship’ by Peter Block which explains how becoming a steward can reconstitute the roles we play in life especially that of the employer and employee. This coincides with Charles work on supporting a gift economy. Another point I’d like to make about this is there have been studies in aid programs in Africa offering mosquito nets to people in need and also offering nets to people for a small fee. Those who paid for the mosquito nets were more likely to use and take care of them. And to reference what the First Nation People coined as what makes a ‘good trade.’ They were expert traders because of living out a gift economy. This means that they traded what had value to them in order to receive something of value, thereby inherently preserving their integrity and instilling an authentic connection with what they acquired from the exchange. I once did this at a barter fair where I traded a highly valued native american flute for a pair of moccasins. It was a challenge to let go of something that was deeply sentimental to me but when I did I was gratifed by a new item backed by a good trade. Building these kinds of healthy relations in our lives is essential to a healthy and vibrant community. Applying integrity (the ethic) and gumption (the principal) are how to be proactive in this, living out a gift economy. From employment AND community / altruism to family and the ecological environment becoming a Steward is the rendering of a healthy working relationship and thereby cultivating a gift economy to it’s fruition.

    Reply
  10. Fern LaRocca says

    October 30, 2014 at 11:38 am

    Thank you so much for such transparency and being an example of your own values put into action. I am also transitioning to a gift relationship with the readers of my digital magazine Mindful Money and it is scary and exciting at the same time. This has inspired me !

    Reply
  11. Bert Joseph VanDercar says

    December 1, 2014 at 2:46 pm

    Thanks for the information on Marie. I have corresponded with her through emails several times and each time I realized I was talking to a real human being and not merely to a social structure expressing itself through impersonal norms and rules. That may seem trivial, but it is not. It was my first real contact with this “organization.” And it made a good impression on me.

    Reply
  12. jason coggins says

    March 11, 2015 at 9:05 pm

    I do what I like to to do because I love to do bussiness and have fun great speach Einstein I hope to win a noble Prize award like your grandfather I love you men I also make music

    Reply
  13. Ryan Heart says

    June 18, 2017 at 1:39 am

    This is a beautiful example of natural and joyful generosity that leads to mutual support within the whole. Thank you for living it.

    Mary, are you fully supported through this gift economy?

    I ask because I so want to live this way.

    Reply
    • Marie Goodwin says

      October 4, 2017 at 12:53 pm

      Hi Ryan,
      I have a partnership and two children. My husband works as well. If I lived alone and simply, I probably could live in the gift in this way. But it comes with less security, month to month, and if you have — for instance — a mortgage or something like that, it would be hard to do. But if you can live in a way where your payments “out” are also flexible, that would be ideal.

      Reply
  14. Ronald says

    August 23, 2017 at 10:52 am

    1. I have been practicing mysticism for 20 years and Charles definitely has stretched me to think bigger and deeper. For that I am grateful. Are there any groups with or without his participation meeting in Asheville? Also, do you have tasks that need volunteer help? I live in Black Mountain half time. I have good computer skills.
    2. Marie, I can find no reference to Charles having a not for profit structure for his work. Are contributions tax deductible?

    Reply
    • Marie Goodwin says

      October 4, 2017 at 12:51 pm

      Hi Ronald,
      Thanks for the questions.
      1) Sometimes he needs help at events, but it isn’t very often. Right now, Charles has pared down his speaking/traveling somewhat to finish his book and start another one (and some learning journeys). Those are things only he can do.
      2) He doesn’t not (yet) have a not-for-profit, but we are considering creating one next year. Contributions to him, right now, are NOT tax deductible, but possibly they will be in the future.

      Marie

      Reply

Leave a Reply Cancel reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Primary Sidebar

All Essays

Peace-building

Time to Push

The Rehearsal is Over

Some Stuff I’m Reading

Beyond Industrial Medicine

A Temple of this Earth

The Sacrificial King

Words to a Young Man

How It Is Going to Be

What I’m doing here

Charles Eisenstein, Antisemite

Mob Morality and the Unvaxxed

Fascism and the Antifestival

The Death of the Festival

Source Temple and the Great Reset

To Reason with a Madman

From QAnon’s Dark Mirror, Hope

World on Fire

We Can Do Better Than This

The Banquet of Whiteness

The Cure of the Earth

Numb

The Conspiracy Myth

The Coronation

Extinction and the Revolution of Love

The Amazon: How do we heal a burning heart?

Building a Peace Narrative

Xylella: Supervillain or Symptom

Making the Universe Great Again

Every Act a Ceremony

The Polarization Trap

Living in the Gift

A Little Heartbreak

Initiation into a Living Planet

Why I am Afraid of Global Cooling

Olive Trees and the Cry of the Land

Our New, Happy Life? The Ideology of Development

Opposition to GMOs is Neither Unscientific nor Immoral

The Age of We Need Each Other

Institutes for Technologies of Reunion

Brushes with the Mainstream

Standing Rock: A Change of Heart

Transcription: Fertile Ground of Bewilderment Podcast

The Election: Of Hate, Grief, and a New Story

This Is How War Begins

The Lid is Off

Of Horseshoe Crabs and Empathy

Scaling Down

The Fertile Ground of Bewilderment

By Their Fruits Ye Shall Know Them

Psychedelics and Systems Change

Mutiny of the Soul Revisited

Why I Don’t Do Internet Marketing

Zika and the Mentality of Control

In a Rhino, Everything

Grief and Carbon Reductionism

The Revolution is Love

Kind is the New Cool

What We Do to Nature, We Do to Ourselves

From Nonviolence to Service

An Experiment in Gift Economics

Misogyny and the Healing of the Masculine

Sustainable Development: Something New or More of the Same?

The Need for Venture Science

The EcoSexual Awakening

“Don’t Owe. Won’t Pay.”

Harder to Hide

Reflections on Damanhur

On Immigration

The Humbler Realms, Part 2

The Humbler Realms

A Shift in Values Everywhere

Letter to my Younger Self

Aluna: A Message to Little Brother

Raising My Children in Trust

Qualitative Dimensions of Collective Intelligence: Subjectivity, Consciousness, and Soul

The Woman Who Chose to Plant Corn

The Oceans are Not Worth $24 trillion

The Baby in the Playpen

What Are We Greedy For?

We Need Regenerative Farming, Not Geoengineering

The Cynic and the Boatbuilder, Revisited

Activism in the New Story

What is Action?

Wasting Time

The Space Between Stories

Breakdown, Chaos, and Emergence

At This Moment, I Feel Held

A Roundabout Endorsement

Imagine a 3-D World

Presentation to Uplift Festival, 12.14.2014

Shadow, Ritual, and Relationship in the Gift

A Neat Inversion

The Waters of Heterodoxy

Localization Beyond Economics

Discipline on the Bus

We Don’t Know: Reflections on the New Story Summit

A Miracle in Scientific American

More Talk?

Why Another Conference?

A Truncated Interview on Racism

A Beautiful World of Abundance

How to Bore the Children

Post-Capitalism

The Malware

The End of War

The Birds are Sad

A Slice of Humble Pie

Bending Reality: But who is the Bender?

The Mysterious Paths by Which Intentions Bear Fruit

The Little Things that Get Under My Skin

A Restorative Response to MH17

Climate Change: The Bigger Picture

Development in the Ecological Age

The campaign against Drax aims to reveal the perverse effects of biofuels

Gateway drug, to what?

Concern about Overpopulation is a Red Herring; Consumption’s the Problem

Imperialism and Ceremony in Bali

Let’s be Honest: Real Sustainability may not make Business Sense

Vivienne Westwood is Right: We Need a Law against Ecocide

2013: Hope or Despair?

2013: A Year that Pierced Me

Synchronicity, Myth, and the New World Order

Fear of a Living Planet

Pyramid Schemes and the Monetization of Everything

The Next Step for Digital Currency

The Cycle of Terror

TED: A Choice Point

The Cynic and the Boatbuilder

Latent Healing

2013: The Space between Stories

We Are Unlimited Potential: A Talk with Joseph Chilton Pearce

Why Occupy’s plan to cancel consumer debts is money well spent

Genetically Modifying and Patenting Seeds isn’t the Answer

The Lovely Lady from Nestle

An Alien at the Tech Conference

We Can’t Grow Ourselves out of Debt

Money and the Divine Masculine

Naivete, and the Light in their Eyes

The Healing of Congo

Why Rio +20 Failed

Permaculture and the Myth of Scarcity

For Facebook, A Modest Proposal

A Coal Pile in the Ballroom

A Review of Graeber’s Debt: The First 5000 Years

Gift Economics Resurgent

The Way up is Down

Sacred Economics: Money, the Gift, and Society in the Age of Transition

Design and Strategy Principles for Local Currency

The Lost Marble

To Bear Witness and to Speak the Truth

Thrive: The Story is Wrong but the Spirit is Right

Occupy Wall Street: No Demand is Big Enough

Elephants: Please Don’t Go

Why the Age of the Guru is Over

Gift Economics and Reunion in the Digital Age

A Circle of Gifts

The Three Seeds

Truth and Magic in the Third Dimension

Rituals for Lover Earth

Money and the Turning of the Age

A Gathering of the Tribe

The Sojourn of Science

Wood, Metal, and the Story of the World

A World-Creating Matrix of Truth

Waiting on the Big One

In the Miracle

Money and the Crisis of Civilization

Reuniting the Self: Autoimmunity, Obesity, and the Ecology of Health

Invisible Paths

Reuniting the Self: Autoimmunity, Obesity, and the Ecology of Health (Part 2)

Mutiny of the Soul

The Age of Water

Money: A New Beginning (Part 2)

Money: A New Beginning (Part 1)

The Original Religion

Pain: A Call for Attention

The Miracle of Self-Creation, Part 2

The Miracle of Self-Creation

The Deschooling Convivium

The Testicular Age

Who Will Collect the Garbage?

The Ubiquitous Matrix of Lies

You’re Bad!

A 28-year Lie: The Wrong Lesson

The Ascent of Humanity

The Stars are Shining for Her

All Hallows’ Eve

Confessions of a Hypocrite

The New Epidemics

From Opinion to Belief to Knowing

Soul Families

For Whom was that Bird Singing?

The Multicellular Metahuman

Grades: A Gun to Your Head

Human Nature Denied

The Great Robbery

Humanity Grows Up

Don’t Should on US

A State of Belief is a State of Being

Ascension

Security and Fate

Old-Fashioned, Healthy, Lacto-Fermented Soft Drinks: The Real “Real Thing”

The Ethics of Eating Meat

Privacy Policy | Contact

Charles Eisenstein

All content on this website is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 International License. Feel free to copy and share.

Celo: 0x755582C923dB215d9eF7C4Ad3E03D29B2569ABb6

Litecoin: ltc1qqtvtkl3h7mchy7m5jwpvqvt5uzka0yj3nffavu

Bitcoin: bc1q2a2czwhf4sgyx9f9ttf3c4ndt03eyh3uymjgzl

Dogecoin: DT9ECVrg9mPFADhN375WL9ULzcUZo8YEpN

Polkadot: 15s6NSM75Kw6eMLoxm2u8qqbgQFYMnoYhvV1w1SaF9hwVpM4

Polygon: 0xEBF0120A88Ec0058578e2D37C9fFdDc28f3673A6

Zcash: t1PUmhaoYTHJAk1yxmgpfEp27Uk4GHKqRig

Donate & Support

As much as possible I offer my work as a gift. I put it online without a pay wall of any kind. Online course contributions are self-determined at the time you register for each. I also keep the site clean of advertising.

This means I rely on voluntary financial support for my livelihood. You may make a recurring gift or one-time donation using the form below, in whatever amount feels good to you. If your finances are tight at all, please do not give money. Visit our contact page instead for other ways to support this work.

Recurring Donations

Note from the team: Your recurring donation is a resource that allows us to keep Charles doing the work we all want him doing: thinking, speaking, writing, rather than worrying about the business details. Charles and all of us greatly appreciate them!

One-Time Donation

Your gift helps us maintain the site, offer tech support, and run programs and events by donation, with no ads, sales pitches, or pay walls. Just as important, it communicates to us that this work is gratefully received. Thank you!

Cryptocurrency Donation

Hi, here we are in the alternate universe of cryptocurrency. Click the link below for a list of public keys. If your preferred coin isn't listed, write to us through the contact form.

View Keys



What kind of donation are you making?(Required)


Recurring Donation

We are currently accepting monthly recurring donations through PayPal; we use PayPal because it allows you to cancel or modify your recurring donation at any time without needing to contact us.


Choose what feels good, clear, and right.

One-Time Donation

We are currently accepting one-time donations with any major credit card or through PayPal.


Choose what feels good, clear, and right.
Donation Method(Required)

Name(Required)
Email(Required)